Saturday, October 25th, 2014

RSS Feed for This PostCurrent Article

Why Jack Bosch is a Turkey

First I should say, hardly anyone even knows about this.

You may remember a few weeks ago when I did an impromptu interview with Jack Bosch of Land Profit Formula.  At the time I was impressed to uncover a real estate investing niche that’s…

  • Refreshingly unique,
  • Unusually low risk,
  • High leverage / high profit,
  • And basically competition-less

Oh, and surprisingly one I’d actually never heard of before.

Then you may also recall that like a big fat turkey, Jack “sold out” of his deal in only a few days, leaving more than a few out in the cold.

Aside: Nice Thanksgiving tie-in, eh?  And yes, it’s a retooled version of the Kramer turkey from Seinfeld ;-)

And I just thought some folks might like to know about this.

He also mentions a special webinar he’s doing on how to outsource the whole shebang, which especially piques my interest.

If you missed the Jack Bosch boat last time, then you should take a minute to see what he’s what he’s got cooking.  Personally I think it’s pretty incredible…..and unlike many others, I don’t say that about just anything.

PS UPDATE: After posting this, you may find it interested that a little controversy ensued within the comments below.  Jack himself stopped by and commented more than once just to set the record straight.  Please feel free to chime in with your own thoughts in response…

Technorati: Jack Bosch, Land Profit Formula, real estate investing

GD Star Rating
loading...

About 

JP Moses is a roughly-hewn man-child who first got into REI after reading Rich Dad, Poor Dad back in Y2K and went full time in 2002. He's tinkered in everything from landlording to short sales to rehabs to Realtoring to REOs to notes to owner financing, blah, blah, blah...Till he finally stuck his flag deep into wholesaling and has since flipped somewhere north of a couple hundred deals.

JP's not a “guru” but also doesn't think it's a bad word. Among his core values are authenticity, creativity, big honkin' value, general fun-ness and being unshaven. He's super proud to be chief blogger guy at REItips.com and host of the free REIology podcast. He also thoroughly enjoys sharing his 53 best real estate investing forms with anyone who wants them. You should totally check that out. :-)

  • Chris

    Hey JP,

    5600 deals in 6 years? C’mon man. If it looks like a duck and walks like a duck…. Your an experienced investor, and you know what would go into doing volume like that, its just not credible. Thats 2.5 deals per day, every day, for six years. Not possible, I promise you, especially with this system. I know this especially because i work the exact same system that Jack teaches in his course. Its a guerilla system, when used profitably and correctly, best suited to doing a few better quality deals, and I mean good deals, per year than large volume. Most deals, even when the owner is found, are not profitable due to the tendency of tax delinquent property having liens as well. I know the system, and Im in a big market, so there is no shortage of property leads. I urge you to protect your reputation from promoting people making outrageous, and obviously false, claims such as this. BTW, Im well aware that this comment has no hope of being published, but its OK.

  • Chris

    Hey JP,

    5600 deals in 6 years? C’mon man. If it looks like a duck and walks like a duck…. Your an experienced investor, and you know what would go into doing volume like that, its just not credible. Thats 2.5 deals per day, every day, for six years. Not possible, I promise you, especially with this system. I know this especially because i work the exact same system that Jack teaches in his course. Its a guerilla system, when used profitably and correctly, best suited to doing a few better quality deals, and I mean good deals, per year than large volume. Most deals, even when the owner is found, are not profitable due to the tendency of tax delinquent property having liens as well. I know the system, and Im in a big market, so there is no shortage of property leads. I urge you to protect your reputation from promoting people making outrageous, and obviously false, claims such as this. BTW, Im well aware that this comment has no hope of being published, but its OK.

  • http://www.landprofitformula.com/ Jack Bosch

    @Chris – hi,

    this is Jack Bosch here.

    I just came across this comment and would like to respond.

    1. I respect your frankness, but before you bash someone, please check the facts.
    2. Go to my webpage http://www.sunnyland.com and look under past auctions for my properties for sale. You will see that I have sold thousands of properties.
    3. When I say 5213 deals, what i mean (and what I explain on my other webpage http://www.secretlandprofits.com) is that this consists of purchases and sales together, meaning I have bought about 2700 properties and sold about 2513 of them (approx.) and currently hold about 180 (+/- a few).
    4. I don’t know where you find your properties but if you focus on LAND only like I do, most properties don’t have any other liens than back taxes.
    5. 63% of my properties are bought without even owing any back taxes.

    So If you are willing to keep your mind open you might see that I do things probably a little different than you do and that it is in deed possibly to do several thousand deals.

    And if you send me an email to jack@secretlandprofits.com I will be gladly sending you some copies of my Live auction brochures (9 auctions to be correct) where each time I sold on average 200 properties in one day (these were my properties which I owned and had bought using this system)

    Thanks,

    Jack

  • http://www.landprofitformula.com Jack Bosch

    @Chris – hi,

    this is Jack Bosch here.

    I just came across this comment and would like to respond.

    1. I respect your frankness, but before you bash someone, please check the facts.
    2. Go to my webpage http://www.sunnyland.com and look under past auctions for my properties for sale. You will see that I have sold thousands of properties.
    3. When I say 5213 deals, what i mean (and what I explain on my other webpage http://www.secretlandprofits.com) is that this consists of purchases and sales together, meaning I have bought about 2700 properties and sold about 2513 of them (approx.) and currently hold about 180 (+/- a few).
    4. I don’t know where you find your properties but if you focus on LAND only like I do, most properties don’t have any other liens than back taxes.
    5. 63% of my properties are bought without even owing any back taxes.

    So If you are willing to keep your mind open you might see that I do things probably a little different than you do and that it is in deed possibly to do several thousand deals.

    And if you send me an email to jack@secretlandprofits.com I will be gladly sending you some copies of my Live auction brochures (9 auctions to be correct) where each time I sold on average 200 properties in one day (these were my properties which I owned and had bought using this system)

    Thanks,

    Jack

  • SoCalGal

    I agree that a “deal” is the buy AND the sale; otherwise, you wouldn’t realize a profit, you would merely be acquiring a non-producing asset. Therefore, stating that one has done 5,213 deals when 2700 were buys and 2513 were sales is intentionally misleading.

    I’m also sick to death of gurus claiming their info is “worth $13,178, but you can have it today for $997–for the first 12 only!” The minute I hear this BS, I’m gone.

  • SoCalGal

    I agree that a “deal” is the buy AND the sale; otherwise, you wouldn’t realize a profit, you would merely be acquiring a non-producing asset. Therefore, stating that one has done 5,213 deals when 2700 were buys and 2513 were sales is intentionally misleading.

    I’m also sick to death of gurus claiming their info is “worth $13,178, but you can have it today for $997–for the first 12 only!” The minute I hear this BS, I’m gone.

  • http://www.reitips.com/ JP Moses

    SoCalGal,

    It doesn’t bother me personally, because it falls under the umbrella of salesmanship if done with honesty and integrity. We, try to entice and compel prospective buyers to buy our houses and we try to effectively negotiation and persuade motivated seller that the solution we have for them is ideal as well – and employ similar salesmanship techniques, like scarcity, perceived value, etc. “Value” is such a subjective thing anyway – it’s in the eye of the beholder in the marketplace, as any good appraiser will remind us.

    Just don’t take it so personally. When people cross the line it’s pretty clear. But I urge you (and everyone) not to lump all “gurus” into the same bucket, just because they do things like put a perceived value on their product that’s notably higher than what they’ll sell it for.

    Thanks for your comments,

    …jp

  • http://www.reitips.com JP Moses

    SoCalGal,

    It doesn’t bother me personally, because it falls under the umbrella of salesmanship if done with honesty and integrity. We, try to entice and compel prospective buyers to buy our houses and we try to effectively negotiation and persuade motivated seller that the solution we have for them is ideal as well – and employ similar salesmanship techniques, like scarcity, perceived value, etc. “Value” is such a subjective thing anyway – it’s in the eye of the beholder in the marketplace, as any good appraiser will remind us.

    Just don’t take it so personally. When people cross the line it’s pretty clear. But I urge you (and everyone) not to lump all “gurus” into the same bucket, just because they do things like put a perceived value on their product that’s notably higher than what they’ll sell it for.

    Thanks for your comments,

    …jp

  • Rodney

    Anyone who’s taken a college business course or read a book on marketing will recognize the tactics employed. I don’t fault Bosch for using proven marketing techniques — hell, anyone who’s ever sold their used car is going to know to wash and polish it up before the sale. This is obvious.

    Instead, I’d like to hear from 1 or 2 folks who’ve actually tried his course. The $1,000,000 question is, does Bosch’s method actually work?

    Understandably there will be those who’ve bought the course and we’re either confused by it or were too lazy to implement it and scream “It doesn’t work! I tried it for a day and nothing.” — there’s always a few. But I’d like to hear from the people who really gave it their all. Of course the claims will be exaggerated but are the fundamentals sound?

    And before folks start soapboxing about their views of tax lien sales, understand that this system is not about that. I’ve seen soo many negative comments from people who see the word “tax lien” and start expounding their negative beliefs without a clue. Just as buying PRE-forclosed properties is different from a foreclosure sale. Such is purchasing PRE-sale liened property. Marketing tactics aside, I have to give Bosch credit for coming up with the idea.

    ——————————————–
    Well said on all points, Rodney.

    …jp

  • Rodney

    Anyone who’s taken a college business course or read a book on marketing will recognize the tactics employed. I don’t fault Bosch for using proven marketing techniques — hell, anyone who’s ever sold their used car is going to know to wash and polish it up before the sale. This is obvious.

    Instead, I’d like to hear from 1 or 2 folks who’ve actually tried his course. The $1,000,000 question is, does Bosch’s method actually work?

    Understandably there will be those who’ve bought the course and we’re either confused by it or were too lazy to implement it and scream “It doesn’t work! I tried it for a day and nothing.” — there’s always a few. But I’d like to hear from the people who really gave it their all. Of course the claims will be exaggerated but are the fundamentals sound?

    And before folks start soapboxing about their views of tax lien sales, understand that this system is not about that. I’ve seen soo many negative comments from people who see the word “tax lien” and start expounding their negative beliefs without a clue. Just as buying PRE-forclosed properties is different from a foreclosure sale. Such is purchasing PRE-sale liened property. Marketing tactics aside, I have to give Bosch credit for coming up with the idea.

    ——————————————–
    Well said on all points, Rodney.

    …jp

  • Chris

    Jack and Rodney,

    Rodney First:

    From a third party perspective, I can say that this does work when applied consistently. Although, there are different approaches and you will have to adjust your approach to your market. And you are right, nothing works in a day. Most people don’t have the will to start a business from scratch, no matter how good the guidance is. Are the fundamentals sound? That should be obvious upon close inspection of the method, although I don’t target the same properties as jack. You have a low competition method of contacting extremely motivated sellers. That is all an investor requires. Whether they can make a business out of those elements is entirely up to the efforts of a particular investor from that point forward.

    As for Jack ‘coming up with the idea’, I assure you that there are many investors using this system before and without Jacks instruction. Jack is the first to market the idea under his land niche. He is the first to do that, if that is what you mean. But I assure you he isn’t the first to come up with this general approach to investing.

    Jack:
    I’m sorry you took it as bashing you. Although I can see how you would perceive it that way. I’m sorry I wasn’t more tactful. But please don’t take it as me bashing your method or quality of instruction. My bashing was isolated to the questioning that specific claim only. Its a natural reaction form an experienced investor working a very similar system. And upon this questioning, we did find out that the number is about half of the claim, in terms of how most investors quantify their deal volume. Which is still a very, very good number. I respect the time and effort it takes to put out a course. We’ll just leave it at that. Accept my sincere apology, but you can also see where my question was justified…

    Land in urban areas most often has expensive liens in the amount it took the city to demolish the previously existing structure. This is my experience in my market. All markets are different. I can see how rural land would not have such liens.

    Best of luck in both of your businesses Jack. I sincerely wish you well in the new year.

    Regards

  • Chris

    Jack and Rodney,

    Rodney First:

    From a third party perspective, I can say that this does work when applied consistently. Although, there are different approaches and you will have to adjust your approach to your market. And you are right, nothing works in a day. Most people don’t have the will to start a business from scratch, no matter how good the guidance is. Are the fundamentals sound? That should be obvious upon close inspection of the method, although I don’t target the same properties as jack. You have a low competition method of contacting extremely motivated sellers. That is all an investor requires. Whether they can make a business out of those elements is entirely up to the efforts of a particular investor from that point forward.

    As for Jack ‘coming up with the idea’, I assure you that there are many investors using this system before and without Jacks instruction. Jack is the first to market the idea under his land niche. He is the first to do that, if that is what you mean. But I assure you he isn’t the first to come up with this general approach to investing.

    Jack:
    I’m sorry you took it as bashing you. Although I can see how you would perceive it that way. I’m sorry I wasn’t more tactful. But please don’t take it as me bashing your method or quality of instruction. My bashing was isolated to the questioning that specific claim only. Its a natural reaction form an experienced investor working a very similar system. And upon this questioning, we did find out that the number is about half of the claim, in terms of how most investors quantify their deal volume. Which is still a very, very good number. I respect the time and effort it takes to put out a course. We’ll just leave it at that. Accept my sincere apology, but you can also see where my question was justified…

    Land in urban areas most often has expensive liens in the amount it took the city to demolish the previously existing structure. This is my experience in my market. All markets are different. I can see how rural land would not have such liens.

    Best of luck in both of your businesses Jack. I sincerely wish you well in the new year.

    Regards

  • Jane Speiser

    I have purchased Jack’s program and I will tell you my real life opinion AFTER I learn it as completely as I can
    Best Regards
    Jane

  • Jane Speiser

    I have purchased Jack’s program and I will tell you my real life opinion AFTER I learn it as completely as I can
    Best Regards
    Jane

  • Bob

    I have been a real estate investor specializing in land investments many years ago. Also have had limited experience with tax sales. This business has been very successful for me. But it took a lot of work, more than most people realize. The rewards were very good, much better than any job. But my question is, in today’s market – FEB 4, 2009 – Can the properties be sold for a reasonable price – like can I even get 50% of MARKET VALUE? This is what really worries me. And I think that the market is not going to get better – we can see that the clowns in Washington have proved that they are not really interested in helping the American on the street to buy a house – they are interested in helping the Banks foreclose on your house. We need honesty, jobs and the law applied to the massive theft in Washington before this economy turns around. That may take more than 10 years at the rate they are going. If there are buyers out there, they have a lot more courage than I do. But I do believe this program is excellent in any kind of a normal economy. Just mho. Thanks.

  • Bob

    I have been a real estate investor specializing in land investments many years ago. Also have had limited experience with tax sales. This business has been very successful for me. But it took a lot of work, more than most people realize. The rewards were very good, much better than any job. But my question is, in today’s market – FEB 4, 2009 – Can the properties be sold for a reasonable price – like can I even get 50% of MARKET VALUE? This is what really worries me. And I think that the market is not going to get better – we can see that the clowns in Washington have proved that they are not really interested in helping the American on the street to buy a house – they are interested in helping the Banks foreclose on your house. We need honesty, jobs and the law applied to the massive theft in Washington before this economy turns around. That may take more than 10 years at the rate they are going. If there are buyers out there, they have a lot more courage than I do. But I do believe this program is excellent in any kind of a normal economy. Just mho. Thanks.

  • http://www.JackBosch.com/ Jack Bosch

    Guys,
    Just came across this again and am surprised this discussion is continuing.

    here is the deal. If you listened closely I usually say that I have “between buying and selling done 5600 transactions”
    (and I use the word transaction usually instead of Deals)

    But I do believe my number of Transactions is 5600 because someone who buys a rental home and holds it forever can say that they did one DEAL. If they buy 50 rental homes they have done 50 deals, but where is the other side of that transaction? Should they therefore only count as half a deal each? Obviously not. They count as full deals. Same for any property that is being held for long term purposes.

    Therefore I consider the transaction of buying a property 1 thing and the transaction of marketing it and selling it again a separate thing. THat is where the number comes from.

    Hope that settles this.
    In any case whichever number you take I think it does give me some level of expertise and there are not a whole lot of people in this country who have done more deals (or transactions) than me.

    Jack

  • http://www.JackBosch.com Jack Bosch

    Guys,
    Just came across this again and am surprised this discussion is continuing.

    here is the deal. If you listened closely I usually say that I have “between buying and selling done 5600 transactions”
    (and I use the word transaction usually instead of Deals)

    But I do believe my number of Transactions is 5600 because someone who buys a rental home and holds it forever can say that they did one DEAL. If they buy 50 rental homes they have done 50 deals, but where is the other side of that transaction? Should they therefore only count as half a deal each? Obviously not. They count as full deals. Same for any property that is being held for long term purposes.

    Therefore I consider the transaction of buying a property 1 thing and the transaction of marketing it and selling it again a separate thing. THat is where the number comes from.

    Hope that settles this.
    In any case whichever number you take I think it does give me some level of expertise and there are not a whole lot of people in this country who have done more deals (or transactions) than me.

    Jack

  • http://www.JackBosch.com/ Jack Bosch

    Rodney,

    Jack Bosch here.
    I just read through this thread and welcome your critical question.

    Check out this blog post I just posted a few days ago.
    http://www.jackbosch.com/testimonials/

    That might help.
    I got a ton of success stories sent to me and these are just a few of them.
    ENjoy
    .-= Jack Bosch´s last blog ..Internet Marketing for Real Estate Investors =-.

  • http://www.JackBosch.com Jack Bosch

    Rodney,

    Jack Bosch here.
    I just read through this thread and welcome your critical question.

    Check out this blog post I just posted a few days ago.
    http://www.jackbosch.com/testimonials/

    That might help.
    I got a ton of success stories sent to me and these are just a few of them.
    ENjoy
    .-= Jack Bosch´s last blog ..Internet Marketing for Real Estate Investors =-.

  • http://www.JackBosch.com/ Jack Bosch

    Bob,

    Jack Bosch here.
    Just read your post.
    Good question. does this work in this market.
    My experience is that it does work great.
    The buying always changes in any market and I have actually been teaching these selling techniques in the last few months and they also work great.

    But to also answer your question on whether or not this works in this market.
    Check out this page.

    http://www.jackbosch.com/testimonials/
    Hope that helps,

    Jack
    .-= Jack Bosch´s last blog ..Internet Marketing for Real Estate Investors =-.

  • http://www.JackBosch.com Jack Bosch

    Bob,

    Jack Bosch here.
    Just read your post.
    Good question. does this work in this market.
    My experience is that it does work great.
    The buying always changes in any market and I have actually been teaching these selling techniques in the last few months and they also work great.

    But to also answer your question on whether or not this works in this market.
    Check out this page.

    http://www.jackbosch.com/testimonials/
    Hope that helps,

    Jack
    .-= Jack Bosch´s last blog ..Internet Marketing for Real Estate Investors =-.

  • jeff

    this is for jane. I am very interested in how well you do w/ jacks program as I have been looking @ it very hard but have not pulled the trigger yet. I have invested in other RE programs w/ some success. some are better than others. they all take work & you will learn more from doing one deal than reading all the books, dvd’s, cd’s & webinars. good luck

  • jeff

    this is for jane. I am very interested in how well you do w/ jacks program as I have been looking @ it very hard but have not pulled the trigger yet. I have invested in other RE programs w/ some success. some are better than others. they all take work & you will learn more from doing one deal than reading all the books, dvd’s, cd’s & webinars. good luck

  • Bill

    I guess it did get published.
    Can be done with bundeling the sales.
    Don't get hung up on the number. Just do the deals.
    I love it when people say it can't be done.
    Just because YOU can't DOES NOT mean it CAN NOT.
    People thought you can't run a 4 minute mile. Now it is common place.
    Stand on the side and watch the dust go by you………………………

  • Leo

    how did it work out 2 yrs later? best, leo

  • Robert Coates

    What difference does it make if it is 2600 deals/transactions or 5200 deals/transactions?  Even the lower number is quite impressive — it’s about 2500 deals more than anybody else commenting here!

    Maybe one of the reasons the number is so high is that he could buy dozens of properties at one tax sale, and he has sold several properties in one day at his own sales. 

  • http://REItips.com/ jp moses

    Right on, Robert…any way you look at it, it’s impressive to be sure.

  • LS

    Jane -

      Just heard about Jack Bosch and read your comment that you were purchasing his program.  I wondered what your thoughts were and if you had any success